Feminist Flounderings (or Thorne's Identity Crisis)
"Whooooo are youuuuu?", The caterpillar asked.
"Well sir, I'm not exactly sure at present", replied Alice. "At least, I knew who I was when I got up this morning, but I must have changed a thousand times since then."
We interrupt our regular programming for an official Thorne's World identity crisis. Regular programming will return next Venusday and tomorrow is looking alot like a surprise Sexual Sinday.
Given my recent rant about the FFF/WOC issue, and now, having been made aware of
"I saw one woman, Renegade Evolution, harrased and threatened to the point where she has now agreed to never speak on feminist issues again."
via Disgusted Beyond Belief in a post entitled: My thoughts on Feminism (as I now head for cover), I'm quite at a loss. I've also been reading alot at Fetch me my axe where a very human woman and feminist (I think she has not yet eschewed the term), and her very human readers make alot more sense than the milque toast mumblings over at Feministing, which I feel are a thin veneer over a sea of judgment and vitriol after FFF/WOC... and now I discover this fucking vile and poisonous attack on tranpersons under the supposed umbrella of feminism!!! While reading there, I'm offered innocuously in the form of a question to consider this piece of garbage masquerading as some sort of feminist political theory, and by the time I got finished with that bag of shit I was just fucking sick at people again.
Fuck this buncha idiots.
Self centered, poisonous, judgmental, wastes of oxygen. This kinda crap is the reason I'm spending more and more time over at Feminist Critics. I'm seriously trying to evaluate if feminism is a movement with which I choose any longer to identify. Or if it has been poisoned and subverted by this current brand of feminism, whatever exactly it is.
I am so offended to think that the feminism I know and love and have held dear for so long has been usurped by these violent poisonous assholes.
*sigh*
Okay, anybody reading this who can help me discover if this blogosphere insanity is a phenomenon in and of itself or if it actually a reflection of the real world, please do. I'm begging. I'm fuckin' dyin' here.
And why do I question the possibility of peace? This crap is one of the reasons.
Labels: blackmail, blogs, feminism, feminism?, idiocy, poison, radfems, sex positive, transpeople
11 Comments:
Well--no, I haven't eschewed the label. I do think "What's in a name," but I don't feel inclined to let the assholes have it. I also think yeah, there's important shit, still. It just maybe isn't up to the most privileged women to lead the way this time. I look at a lot of the WOC, the queers, the disability activists, the socialist feminists, the people who generally get the notion of -intersection- for various reasons.
and, also, i look at the people who are willing to listen and learn and aren't being complete fuckbags.
it's a process.
as per FC...mmm, well, yeah. anyway I'm glad you're posting there, maybe i'll stop back in now that Ren's hosting too. I...had issues with it. Nice enough guys hosting it, but I didn't see the analysis as terribly sophisticated or interesting a lot of the time. and that was without the aggravating troll factor. eventually they got rid of one of 'em, but NYMOM's a pip, and various drive-bys add to the annoyance factor, sooo...
[Disclaimer:] I am not an identity crisis counselor. In fact, I was barred from The Third Rock From The Sun for practicing withot a license. Thusly, anything I write here will be a meaningless waste of your bandwidth. I am however, expert in that regard.
Having read you for some time, and plundered your archives with abandon, I'm left with the impression Thorne knows exactly who she is, and what she wants. So it occurs to me, is the crisis Thorne's identity.....Or Thorne's crisis of the "percieved" Identity of Sexuality?
My head hurts. I gotta go lay down.
belledame222:
as per FC...mmm, well, yeah. anyway I'm glad you're posting there, maybe i'll stop back in now that Ren's hosting too. I...had issues with it. Nice enough guys hosting it,...
Thank you.
but I didn't see the analysis as terribly sophisticated or interesting a lot of the time...
I'm disappointed to hear that. Perhaps you could point out more specifically where our analysis lacks sophistication and how it could be improved.
...and that was without the aggravating troll factor. eventually they got rid of one of 'em, but NYMOM's a pip, and various drive-bys add to the annoyance factor, sooo...
I just banned her too.
As for the drive-bys, well, they're a problem on any blog.
Hey, Daran, good call. God that woman was annoying.
Yeah, I think I mentioned a few things that I would've liked to have seen early on; eventually I started to feel like I was going into someone's house and telling them how to rearrange all the furniture, so I ended up just backing off.
but, you know, among other things I noted, bringing in off-blog, historical feminist theory and activism would be a help, if it's going to be criticism of feminism per se, as opposed to, y'know, what i saw as an attempt to start talking about mens' stuff specifically. maybe you have done since I've last been in there, I'll stop by soonish.
belledamme,
Thanks for stopping by.
"What's in a name," but I don't feel inclined to let the assholes have it.
Yeah, that's what I've come away with. Fuck um!
re: FC
but, you know, among other things I noted, bringing in off-blog, historical feminist theory and activism would be a help, if it's going to be criticism of feminism per se
I'd like to see more of that, too, but frankly I'd need to see you or others like you over there too, because I admit that's NOT my area.
Ahhh, Daran.
That NYMOM woman was the most obvious sexist at the site (aside from the new jackd77), IMO.
The Future Was Yesterday said...
So it occurs to me, is the crisis Thorne's identity.....Or Thorne's crisis of the "percieved" Identity of Sexuality?
LOL! Thanks for commenting, hon. Actually it wasn't an "identity" so much as an "identification" crisis!!! LOL!
And yeah, perception has ALOT to do with sexuality and gender!
Hi Thorne~
Follwed you here from dbb, and I just started reading FC last night. I only have a few hours of reading over there under my belt, but based on that I'd agree with what Belle said. I'm not a big poster, but maybe I'll post there soon.
In my experience of feminism in real life, I have not encountered many of the extreme points of view that are expressed on certain feminist blogs. Especially wrt transgender people and porn/sex industry issues. In fact, the first time I ran up against the anti-transgender stuff I was dumbstruck by the level of hate.
One of the first things I learned in the first women's-studies class I ever took was about the intersections of oppressions, and that privilege is not absolute. Another was that a goal of feminism is that all women's voices be heard. Those ideas have continued to inform my feminism. I agree with you about the bs that's going on on feminist (esp the radical flavor) blogs. In fact, I was about to give up reading them when I came across the carnival at Fetch Me My Axe.
Ok, I'm rambling (this is one of the reasons I don't post) but I wanted you to know that I'm out here, and I'm thinking about a lot of the same things that you are, and to say I hope you don't give up on feminism just yet.
I can appreciate the thoughts of Belle and others who do not want to let the 'haters' have ownership of a label you hold dear - 'feminism' - I can understand that completely.
In some ways, I'm sure it feels like giving up to cede the label to them. But when I suggested it, I did it based on practical considerations - I mean, is it ever really possible to rehabilitate a word once it has been corrupted? Right now, the word 'liberal' has been so poisoned by right-wing propeganda that 'liberals' (in large blocks)gave up the word and now call themselves 'progressives'.
I think part of the bad press for feminism comes from right-wing smears. But I think a lot of it comes from what Thorne discusses here - and what has happened to Ren (and now happened again with the shelter issue).
When I first explored the feminist blogsphere, I did not have any particular ideas in mind about feminism beyond the fact that I favor total equality between genders.
The more I've thought about it, the more I've concluded that it is a necessary step in a practical sense, for three overriding and interrelated reasons. One is that the word has already gotten some bad connotations, which may never be overcome in the popular mind. Second, the word, by its nature, is obviously only about women, so even though that may not be true of the movement as a whole, from the start it makes an 'us' versus 'them' mentality the starting point. For women. (With the enemy being 'patriarchy' - against men). And third, and perhaps most important, the reason why number one and two can likely never really be overcome despite the best efforts and intentions of those involved - you have the actual actions and words of some of the self-identified radical feminists, who are a very vocal minority - and who clearly hate men, and hate women who don't kowtow to them, and in many ways are far worse in their treatment of women than most of the 'patriarchy' ever were. And such women will never leave 'feminism' behind - they love that word they love its female-exlusivity and male-bashing implications, and so long as you are in a movement that has as a label they chose to share and self-identify with, they will always drag down the movement. Whereas a gender-neutral named movement they would NEVER join because they really aren't for anything but their own personal matriarchal supremacy, with themselves as the self-appointed matriarchs. Thus, you'd lose all the baggage currently attached to 'feminsm' and you'd also prevent the haters from following you into the new movement to spoil it by blowing up the bridge behind you - they would never cross into true gender-neutral territory. Even if the movement still spent 80% of its efforts on improving things for women in the gender-role challenging sense - because that 20% challenging of male gender roles (to help men) would, along with the gender-neutral label, be just too much for them to bear.
Ok, sorry to jump in and spew my thoughts all over your blog... guess I just can't help myself... ;)
You know who you are from what I've read on your site. The problems are with the 'name' or what I call 'labels'. What I've read on your site I can say I agree with but do I agree with everyone's interpretation of "feminism" and those who agree with them? No. Everywhere you look you can find those who will twist a 'label' to make it what they want. Because I love and live with a woman doesn't mean that I agree with every definition of a lesbian and so I refuse to have any label on myself. I will speak my truth through my words, my writings and my actions. Fight for what I believe to be right and there will be those who will claim I am fighting for their 'label' when what I live for is humanity and all those I love. There will always be someone who will agree or not agree with who 'they' think I am. But I will always be me. Just as you are you. Don't waist your energy argueing the point. Continue fighting with who you are and your wonderful writing. Excuse the rambling...LC
Beansa, thank you for stopping by. I enjoyed your discussion at DBB's thread. I went by your blog, but??? Are you writing somewhere else?? I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one that doesn't get the feminism insanity in the world, still... I don't get out much! LOL!
DBB, thanks, hon.
LC, thank you for coming, and thanks for your support. I've always loved to explore labels without labeling; if that makes any sense. Maybe because I love words so well, and is there anything better than discovering "le bon mot" for the description or situation?? *sigh* So sorry I haven't been by to sit with you and stargaze from the deck...
Don't be sorry, you came, you wrote and you made me smile! I'm happy to hear you signed up for the show! Can't wait to hear about it - LC
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